On Fri, 10 Jun 2011 21:05:21 +0100, Hugo Nebula wrote:

> This (http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/TLES42C.html) is what my
> electrician suggested. To me it looks a bit flimsy and the range is
> only 110 degrees. How good can it be for a tenner?

Do you have to ask... That's the going price for black painted
pressed steel.

> This (http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/STHS500B.html) looks a better
> bet.

Well that says it's diecast ally, but which bits? If the mount and
lamp housing it should last more than one winter.

I question the spec of 500W that is an awful lot of light, you won't
be able to see anything in the deep black shadows it will create. The
"wildlife" will be able to hide in those shadows...

Several much lower power lights along the side wall over the drive
would be better. They will tend to mutually "fill" the shadow a given
lamp produces and with less light about the shadows won't be so
black. You only need to illuminate the drive so anyone there can be
seen, you don't need 500W of halagen light to do that.

Of course you are now going to say your garden is the size of a
football pitch...

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Jun 10, 11:37*pm, "Dave Liquorice" <allsortsnotthis...@howhill.com>
wrote:
> On Fri, 10 Jun 2011 21:05:21 +0100, Hugo Nebula wrote:
> > This (http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/TLES42C.html) is what my
> > electrician suggested. To me it looks a bit flimsy and the range is
> > only 110 degrees. How good can it be for a tenner?
>
> Do you have to ask... That's the going price for black painted
> pressed steel.
>
> > This (http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/STHS500B.html) looks a better
> > bet.
>
> Well that says it's diecast ally, but which bits? If the mount and
> lamp housing it should last more than one winter.
>
> I question the spec of 500W that is an awful lot of light, you won't
> be able to see anything in the deep black shadows it will create. The
> "wildlife" will be able to hide in those shadows...
>
> Several much lower power lights along the side wall over the drive
> would be better. They will tend to mutually "fill" the shadow a given
> lamp produces and with less light about the shadows won't be so
> black. You only need to illuminate the drive so anyone there can be
> seen, you don't need 500W of halagen light to do that.
>
> Of course you are now going to say your garden is the size of a
> football pitch...

500w halogens are obsolescent. If you want that much light from one
fittings, go with cfl or other options, but not halogen.


NT

In message <(E-Mail Removed)>, Hugo Nebula
<abuse@localhost.?.invalid> wrote
>[Default] On Fri, 10 Jun 2011 23:37:30 +0100 (BST), a certain
>chimpanzee, "Dave Liquorice" <(E-Mail Removed)>,
>randomly hit the keyboard and wrote:
>
>>I question the spec of 500W that is an awful lot of light, you won't
>>be able to see anything in the deep black shadows it will create. The
>>"wildlife" will be able to hide in those shadows...
>
>My electrician did think that 150W might not be enough.

It will more than enough to cause a nuisance to near neighbours. Having
fitted 150W, 200W, 400W or 500W lights you may soon afterwards to get
some robust requests to disable them.

Whatever your electrician does make sure that you have a way off
manually turning them all off. The PIR sensors often have a mode where
switching on/off in a sequence can put them into a mode to leave the
light on. This can happen during mains disruption or after power is
restored after a power failure. Having a couple of kW of lighting
permanently on can get expensive.

Perhaps have low level lighting pretending to provide light for a dummy
camera with a bright flashing red LED. Wouldn't this provide the same
type of deterrent?
--
Alan
news2009 {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On Jun 11, 2:00*pm, Hugo Nebula <abuse@localhost> wrote:
> [Default] On Fri, 10 Jun 2011 23:37:30 +0100 (BST), a certain
> chimpanzee, "Dave Liquorice" <allsortsnotthis...@howhill.com>,
> randomly hit the keyboard and wrote:
>
> >I question the spec of 500W that is an awful lot of light, you won't
> >be able to see anything in the deep black shadows it will create. The
> >"wildlife" will be able to hide in those shadows...
>
> My electrician did think that 150W might not be enough. With the
> higher wattage floodlights we could experiment with 400W, 300W or 200W
> elements to find a reasonable level.

100-200w is around the sort of total suitable, so about 25-50w of cfl.
If you're lighting that much with just one fitting you need it mounted
high up, and be sure you can reach the bulb & cover from an upstairs
window to change it. Its always going to look better if you use more
than one light fitting, but if youre not diying of course that would
add cost.

An unlikely possible alternative is low voltage LED dice. You could
mount them within reach, and wire it without the complications of
mains voltage, making the exercise quicker and easier.


NT

Hugo Nebula <abuse@localhost> wrote:
> [Default] On Fri, 10 Jun 2011 23:37:30 +0100 (BST), a certain
> chimpanzee, "Dave Liquorice" <(E-Mail Removed)>,
> randomly hit the keyboard and wrote:
>
>> I question the spec of 500W that is an awful lot of light, you won't
>> be able to see anything in the deep black shadows it will create. The
>> "wildlife" will be able to hide in those shadows...
>
> My electrician did think that 150W might not be enough. With the
> higher wattage floodlights we could experiment with 400W, 300W or 200W
> elements to find a reasonable level.

I can recommend these (or similar)

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/GLSFB26PC.html

if you want brighter then use the 42W version. The non photocell versions
work with PIRs.

--
Adam

The Medway Handyman <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> On 11/06/2011 14:49, Alan wrote:
>> In message <(E-Mail Removed)>, Hugo Nebula
>> <abuse@localhost.?.invalid> wrote
>>> [Default] On Fri, 10 Jun 2011 23:37:30 +0100 (BST), a certain
>>> chimpanzee, "Dave Liquorice" <(E-Mail Removed)>,
>>> randomly hit the keyboard and wrote:
>>>
>>>> I question the spec of 500W that is an awful lot of light, you
>>>> won't be able to see anything in the deep black shadows it will
>>>> create. The "wildlife" will be able to hide in those shadows...
>>>
>>> My electrician did think that 150W might not be enough.
>>
>> It will more than enough to cause a nuisance to near neighbours.
>> Having fitted 150W, 200W, 400W or 500W lights you may soon
>> afterwards to get some robust requests to disable them.
>>
>> Whatever your electrician does make sure that you have a way off
>> manually turning them all off. The PIR sensors often have a mode
>> where switching on/off in a sequence can put them into a mode to
>> leave the light on. This can happen during mains disruption or after
>> power is restored after a power failure. Having a couple of kW of
>> lighting permanently on can get expensive.
>
> Seconded. A few years ago I fitted 2 PIR lights to a bungalow in a
> remote village & the owners kept finding them on all night. It wasn't
> till I noticed the clocks on the ladies oven & microwave blinking (3rd
> visit) that I sussed it.
>
> Brief power interruption/resumption during the night put them in
> manual mode.

The smarter sensors revert back to normal mode at the next sunrise.

--
Adam

In article <it0g24$4kv$(E-Mail Removed)>, ARWadsworth
<(E-Mail Removed)> writes
>fred <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>> In article <isvvnu$iu$(E-Mail Removed)>, ARWadsworth
>> <(E-Mail Removed)> writes
>>> Hugo Nebula <abuse@localhost> wrote:
>>>> [Default] On Fri, 10 Jun 2011 23:37:30 +0100 (BST), a certain
>>>> chimpanzee, "Dave Liquorice" <(E-Mail Removed)>,
>>>> randomly hit the keyboard and wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I question the spec of 500W that is an awful lot of light, you
>>>>> won't be able to see anything in the deep black shadows it will
>>>>> create. The "wildlife" will be able to hide in those shadows...
>>>>
>>>> My electrician did think that 150W might not be enough. With the
>>>> higher wattage floodlights we could experiment with 400W, 300W or
>>>> 200W elements to find a reasonable level.
>>>
>>> I can recommend these (or similar)
>>>
>>> http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/GLSFB26PC.html
>>>
>>> if you want brighter then use the 42W version. The non photocell
>>> versions work with PIRs.
>>>
>> I like the idea of having the PIR separate so you can just have a
>> switched live going to for manual switching.
>>
>> Relay output PIR ok for the photocell one?
>
>Is there any point having the photocell version with a seperate PIR as most
>PIRs already have a built in photocell?
>
Good point . . . .

Now to find a PIR that doesn't have 'helpful' override modes, if stuck I
might end up using a burglar alarm PIR and use a photocell floodlight
after all.
--
fred
FIVE TV's superbright logo - not the DOG's, it's *******s

fred <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> In article <it0g24$4kv$(E-Mail Removed)>, ARWadsworth
> <(E-Mail Removed)> writes
>> fred <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>> In article <isvvnu$iu$(E-Mail Removed)>, ARWadsworth
>>> <(E-Mail Removed)> writes
>>>> Hugo Nebula <abuse@localhost> wrote:
>>>>> [Default] On Fri, 10 Jun 2011 23:37:30 +0100 (BST), a certain
>>>>> chimpanzee, "Dave Liquorice" <(E-Mail Removed)>,
>>>>> randomly hit the keyboard and wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I question the spec of 500W that is an awful lot of light, you
>>>>>> won't be able to see anything in the deep black shadows it will
>>>>>> create. The "wildlife" will be able to hide in those shadows...
>>>>>
>>>>> My electrician did think that 150W might not be enough. With the
>>>>> higher wattage floodlights we could experiment with 400W, 300W or
>>>>> 200W elements to find a reasonable level.
>>>>
>>>> I can recommend these (or similar)
>>>>
>>>> http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/GLSFB26PC.html
>>>>
>>>> if you want brighter then use the 42W version. The non photocell
>>>> versions work with PIRs.
>>>>
>>> I like the idea of having the PIR separate so you can just have a
>>> switched live going to for manual switching.
>>>
>>> Relay output PIR ok for the photocell one?
>>
>> Is there any point having the photocell version with a seperate PIR
>> as most PIRs already have a built in photocell?
>>
> Good point . . . .
>
> Now to find a PIR that doesn't have 'helpful' override modes, if
> stuck I might end up using a burglar alarm PIR and use a photocell
> floodlight after all.

Burgular alarm PIRs tend to have a 1 second timer!

I have fitted the non photocell versions with seperate PIRs and all was
well:-)

Personally, I use a 35W CDM-T dusk till dawn flood light at my house. A very
bright and very white light. At least the same light output as a 300W
halogen.

--
Adam

In article <it0h6i$bns$(E-Mail Removed)>, ARWadsworth
<(E-Mail Removed)> writes
>fred <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>
>> Now to find a PIR that doesn't have 'helpful' override modes, if
>> stuck I might end up using a burglar alarm PIR and use a photocell
>> floodlight after all.
>
>Burgular alarm PIRs tend to have a 1 second timer!
>
Yep, second time you've caught me out today not thinking :-)

>I have fitted the non photocell versions with seperate PIRs and all was
>well:-)
>
>Personally, I use a 35W CDM-T dusk till dawn flood light at my house. A very
>bright and very white light. At least the same light output as a 300W
>halogen.
>
This is for an older rellie who likes to have a visual indication of
intruders, be they scrotes, pussies or foxes so PIR is indicated. The
more expensive PIRs (steinel) have the desired performance but I'd like
to put in multiples to get all routes covered and it's looking pricey.

We've had multifunction ones lock up in always-on in the past and she's
far enough away that a single visit to recover the situation costs more
that the cheapie light unit, so I want to avoid them.
--
fred
FIVE TV's superbright logo - not the DOG's, it's *******s

fred <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> This is for an older rellie who likes to have a visual indication of
> intruders, be they scrotes, pussies or foxes so PIR is indicated. The
> more expensive PIRs (steinel) have the desired performance but I'd
> like to put in multiples to get all routes covered and it's looking
> pricey.

That's why I swapped the PIR lights at my parents for dusk till dawns. My
Dad used to open the curtains and have a look everytinme the PIR
activated.:-)


> We've had multifunction ones lock up in always-on in the past and
> she's far enough away that a single visit to recover the situation
> costs more that the cheapie light unit, so I want to avoid them.

I have fitted a couple of beam detectors at places where normal PIRs would
have lots of false alarms and never had a problem with them apart from snow
covering the sensors..

--
Adam